Sobriety in Style: with Josh James a Leader in the Non-Alc Beverage Movement, EP 43

Welcome to Episode 43 of the Feel Lit Alcohol Free Podcast! Today we're thrilled to be joined by Joshua James—once a seasoned bartender, now the visionary behind San Francisco’s first non-alcoholic bar, Ocean Beach Cafe. What made him quit drinking at 37 and lead a global movement toward alcohol-free living? His journey from mixologist to sober trailblazer is nothing short of inspiring.

In this episode, we dig deep into why millennials and Gen Z are turning their backs on alcohol and embracing adaptogenic elixirs and non-alcoholic cocktails. Joshua shares honest critiques of non-alcoholic spirits, and what’s driving this powerful shift toward wellness and adaptogenic elixirs and alcohol-free cocktails? He and Ruby touch on how the traditional alcohol industry is scrambling to catch up with this new wave of sober curiosity! 

Josh also reveals his pick for the BEST NA Red wine from an amazing winemaker Zeronimo in Austria. A good NA red has been hard to find, until now. Click here to check it out!
USE DISCOUNT CODE ZERONIMO10 FOR 10% OFF YOUR PURCHASE!

If you’re ready to rethink your drink and discover how to feel lit without liquor, you won’t want to miss this episode. Let’s dive in!"

Where to find and follow Josh James: https://www.oceanbeachcafe.com/
@joshthenonalcoholic 

Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, and ask us any questions you have about breaking free from wine or living an alcohol-free lifestyle. Your question could be the highlight of a future episode!

Grab our Feel Lit Weekend Guide!
https://feellitpodcast.com/Guide

Watch Episode on Youtube! https://www.youtube.com/@FeelLitAlcoholFreePodcast/videos

Websites:
Susan Larkin Coaching https://www.susanlarkincoaching.com/
Ruby Williams at Freedom Renegade Coaching https://www.freedomrenegadecoaching.com/

Follow Susan: @drinklesswithsusan
Follow Ruby: @rubywilliamscoaching

It is strongly recommended that you seek professional advice regarding your health before attempting to take a break from alcohol. The creators, hosts, and producers of the The Feel Lit Alcohol Free podcast are not healthcare practitioners and therefore do not give medical, or psychological advice nor do they intend for the podcast, any resource or communication on behalf of the podcast or otherwise to be a substitute for such.

Transcript

Sick and tired of your love-hate relationship with wine?
Welcome to the feel it alcohol free podcast. Hi. I'm coach Ruby Williams. And I'm coach Susan Larkin. We are 2 former wine lovers turned alcohol freedom coaches exposing the lies about alcohol and giving you, our listeners, the tools to break free so you can feel lit. And when you're lit, you'll feel healthier, freer, and more in control of your life. So relax, kick back, and get ready to feel lit alcohol free. And don't forget, grab a copy of our wine free weekend guide after the show.

Coach Ruby [00:00:02]:
Welcome back to the feel at alcohol free podcast. I have a surprise, a special guest. Joshua James is here. And, yeah, I'm going to tell you a little bit about Josh. Welcome. Then we're going to have a really just candid conversation. 

Coach Ruby [00:00:23]:
So excited to be here with Susan, as usual. And we also have Joshua James. He's a gregarious 42 year old, is a career bartender who always had a passion for sharing the vast world of cocktails, beer, wine, and others. However, he knew for years that he needed to stop drinking. So at late 37, he made a commitment to quit alcohol for a year to see what would fill the void of something that was so prominent in his life. 11 months into his journey, he became the owner of Ocean Beach Cafe in San Francisco. Because he wasn't drunk or hungover, he, yeah, he opened it for a very specific reason, to create a hospitality driven non alcoholic bar and retail bottle shop. And his goal was to lure people into the space with great coffee, sandwiches.

Coach Ruby [00:01:16]:
And so, he could show them that the thriving world of nonalcoholic beer, wine, elixirs, and cocktails, all while in a modern sobriety movement, was taking hold. Right? And to backtrack a bit, in 2020, Joshua began his path to sobriety at the Friendship House, a Native American inpatient treatment center in San Francisco. And then he started creating the no booze reviews, the no booze reviews as Josh the non alcoholic on YouTube, reviewing as many non alcoholic beverages as he could get his hands on. So, Ocean Beach Cafe became one of the first non alcoholic bars and bottle shops in the world.

Coach Susan [00:02:02]:
Wow.

Coach Ruby [00:02:02]:
And has conducted almost a 1000 hour long tastings and 90 minute NA mixology classes by reservation. So Ochon Beach Cafe has been very successful as a vibrant community hub, hosting weekly beach cleanups, serving plenty of lattes and sandwiches, and providing awareness to nearly every customer about the growing movement of people choosing to drink less or not at all. So welcome, Joshua. Welcome.

Joshua James [00:02:31]:
Thank you, guys. So, so, so stoked to be here. Thank you, guys, for having me. This is gonna be fun.

Coach Ruby [00:02:38]:
It is. Yeah. So, I know I just talked a lot there, but do you want to continue with any other introduction and maybe provide a bit more of a background on your alcohol free journey? Let's start there. Yeah.

Joshua James [00:02:52]:
Yeah. I think you guys covered a lot of things. Full disclosure. I did write that, with the help of you guys. So I kinda wanted to pack it all in, but there's so much to talk about that, you know, I could write that one and a half minute introduction and still have easily 45 minutes to talk about this very, very big thing that's going on. This is certainly not a small thing. I'm quite sure that people don't really, really know how big of a thing it is. I'd love to talk about that and, and and and a bunch of other things.

Joshua James [00:03:27]:
But, yeah, you don't get all of this stuff if I was just continuing drinking like I did for 20 years. And

Coach Susan [00:03:37]:
Mhmm.

Joshua James [00:03:37]:
And it took a radical shift to get there. And I know that can be scary for a lot of people. And I would recommend just flipping that and being, like, instead of being scared that it's not gonna be fun or, or, you know, life just will be more dull. You can totally flip that around and be, like, get excited about it. Like, what fills that void? Because there's so much that can be added to life and spirit and aura and vibe and what you put out there and what comes back around and so many other things. So go for it. Get excited about it, actually. It's nothing to lose.

Coach Ruby [00:04:22]:
That's why we're called feel lit, alcohol free. Yeah. You're speaking our language, Josh.

Coach Susan [00:04:28]:
Absolutely.  I mean, what have you have

Coach Susan [00:04:30]:
to lose? I think if you're not all in too, it just is so much less enjoyable. Like that's what When I decided to make a change, it was like I wanted to create the best life I could alcohol free. Like that goal is so different than just, well, I guess I better quit drinking, you know? Yeah. So, yeah, I love that.

Coach Ruby [00:04:49]:
And the truth is if you're drinking and hungover, how could you have started a cafe? I mean, at least for me, there was no like, those, goals and starting, like, a business just was not possible if you're always hungover. So how did, like, this idea come about, this Ocean Beach Cafe?

Joshua James [00:05:09]:
Ocean Beach Cafe came about pretty naturally for me. I had actually dabbled because I stopped drinking in December 2019. But before that year, I had looked into, like, some I took, like, 2 weeks off drinking here and there, and and sometimes 3 weeks. In those times, like, after about a week, I got really productive, and I was like, oh, this is fun. I can use my brain. I can be really productive. And a couple of those times, I was like, let's look into nonalcoholic bars. Let's look into how I was in Asheville, North Carolina at the time, kinda randomly.

Joshua James [00:05:45]:
And I was like, okay. Like, where would it be? Like, what's out there? Would this work? Let's kinda put a little business proposal together. So I was dabbling during that time. And then I went to San Francisco into the Friendship House, and COVID hit. So I was there for about three and a half months. I left, and then I went back to San Francisco to live at a sober living house. And I was I. I started there's no booze reviews as Josh, a nonalcoholic on YouTube, and I was actively not being a bartender. I was like, I'm not gonna work at another restaurant at 38.

Joshua James [00:06:21]:
I'm good at that for sure. In fact, I'm selling an item on Amazon, and I wanna work remotely. But I was shooting those videos, walked into a deli one day to get some coffee, and the guy was like, you wanna buy the place? And I was like, sure. That was how it went down. I was probably there, I don't know, less than a minute, I think. And he was in a really bad spot permanently closing during COVID. And he's like, I was like, yeah. How much? And he's like, $50,000.

Joshua James [00:06:53]:
And I was like, for everything? He's like, yeah. It's turnkey. Everything's clean. Everything works. And I was like, yeah. Do you mind if I sit down? And I was half joking, but I was also like, that's just kind of my personality. Like, yeah. Do you mind if I sit down? And then that ended up happening.

Joshua James [00:07:10]:
And right when I left that conversation, I left and I got on my godaddy.com and was like oceanbeachcafe.com, enter. And it was like a green light. It's available. And I was like, damn it. Man, I was getting out of this industry.

Coach Ruby [00:07:29]:
Wow. But you know it's a new industry. This is actually, we were, Susan and I were just at a sober in the city event, recently. And, this is not the same. It's a brand new category, brand new industry. You know?

Joshua James [00:07:46]:
This absolutely is a new thing for society, and it's not something that's really happened before. Like, some things go out of fashion and back in. So, like, let's say rum is having a moment in the alcohol world and bartenders know it, so there's a bunch of rum things happening or something like that. It's something that had been before and then it, you know, things go cyclical. This is not that. Yeah. This is like, oh, there's 500 brands that just came out. And what I like to impress upon people is how powerful that is.

Joshua James [00:08:19]:
That so many brands have come out, and all of them are fighting for visibility and awareness of their brands. And then there's, like, all the news articles that are written about the subject. It's like this new thing. It's trending, but definitely not a fad. And Yes. This is just a very, very, very big thing, which I'm looking forward to talking about more, but definitely a new market. And the numbers are much bigger than people know.

Coach Ruby [00:08:48]:
Yeah. Yes. In fact, when you and I met you, about a year and a half ago at Ocean Beach Cafe to talk about this whole alcohol free movement and everything. And you had said you wanted to get a nonalcoholic beverage in every single restaurant in San Francisco. That was what you were telling me back then. Is that still a goal of yours?

Joshua James [00:09:12]:
Oh, absolutely. I have so much passion to go talk to every one of the bartenders. One of my jokes is like, if every bartender came into Ocean Beach Cafe for, like, 6 minutes, the whole landscape of nonalcoholic beverage availability in bars and restaurants in the Bay Area would be completely different. And being so all consumed, having to be at the cafe has not allowed me to get out there like I want to. And I'll tell you right now, they all know about me. Any restaurant and bar that I go to, if I bring it up every single time, more than 9 times out of 10, the bartender's like, oh my god. I've heard about that place. I've been meaning to check it out.

Joshua James [00:09:50]:
I can't wait. And I'm just like,

Joshua James [00:09:53]:
down here, man. You get down here. You know how important this is.

Coach Ruby [00:09:55]:
Cool.

Coach Susan [00:09:56]:
That's awesome. Yeah.

Coach Ruby [00:10:00]:
I'm just so proud of you, Joshua. Like, and you've kinda become, in my mind, like a rock star in the sober verse because and you're making it cool. Right? I feel cool, you know, that I'm alcohol free, actually. Well, thank thank you for

Joshua James [00:10:17]:
letting me know that because I don't get to see it outside of my own world and sphere as much. Although, I do get to see it more because I've been traveling a lot, like, a lot a lot, which is absolutely the dream, conventions and public speaking engagements, more conventions, and so now I'm in a bunch of different places. And so now I'm starting to get a little bit more of, well, I just had Caffe Brain in a bad way for, like, two and a half years. And now I'm kind of set free to do what I really wanna do. So it's been amazing.

Coach Ruby [00:10:50]:
Awesome. And aren't you going to Vienna or something soon? And what's in Vienna?

Joshua James [00:10:57]:
I'm going to Austria, and I guess Susan is too. Right?

Coach Susan [00:11:02]:
Yes.

Joshua James [00:11:03]:
So we just found out, like,

Coach Ruby [00:11:04]:
2 weeks ago. Yeah.

Coach Susan [00:11:05]:
At the same time.

Coach Ruby [00:11:06]:
It's so crazy.

Joshua James [00:11:08]:
Just found out that Yeah.

Coach Susan [00:11:10]:
It's very exciting to be there.

Joshua James [00:11:14]:
Sorry about that.

Coach Susan [00:11:18]:
Yeah. No. That's great. I'm excited to be there. And I'd heard about this new wine. I actually heard it through your Instagram and, it was, and then I think I commented or something. And then on Instagram, they DM'd me, and I said, well, I'm gonna be in Austria. And they said, well, come by for a tasting.

Coach Susan [00:11:36]:
And so I was like, what? That's so great.

Joshua James [00:11:40]:
It is such a big deal. It is, like, the biggest deal ever. People always ask me, like, if you were to get well, are you gonna make your own product? I get asked that all the time over the years. And I always would say, you know, there's 2 things I'd probably get involved in. And one of them would be, like, a potent, like, 2 ounce, maybe plastic bottle that's easy to ship that has, like, a lot of adaptogens and functional ingredients in it. Mhmm. And and would be, you know, something that Gen Z could be drinking in a year from now. You know, something like that.

Joshua James [00:12:15]:
And then something that would make somebody feel something, but that's because it's being productive within the body and brain. Or nonalcoholic red wine. Easy. Like, I mean, whoever cracks nonalcoholic red wine, like, that's gonna be a very successful person. I would always say that. Because nonalcoholic red wine is almost not worth buying. Like, almost I mean, it is because but it's man

Coach Ruby [00:12:38]:
We haven't found any. Yeah.

Joshua James [00:12:40]:
Yeah. It's a it's a it's a it's a it's a whole thing, and it's just it's so hard to do. So it came to me about 6 or 7 months ago, and it’s from Austria. And I'm like, I'm looking at the label. I'm like, okay. Here we go again. Nonalcoholic red. And then I smelled it, and I was like, wait a minute.

Joshua James [00:13:02]:
And then I drank it, and I was like, where is this from? Like, am I going to Austria or Germany next month? Am I gonna find this one or talk I'm gonna talk to the owner. So I was talking to the owner the next day, and we just totally hit it off. It was all very natural that they needed to get into the US. And I was like, I know who brings stuff into the US. Like, I can help you with that. And then it just went so well. It's been so natural and so easy. They're so pro, but they're so loving and they're so passionate about wine.

Joshua James [00:13:39]:
They make a very successful 98 point rated red wine in Austria, and they have so for, like, decades. And they make other ones as well that are less expensive, but the one they decided to alcoholize was their big boy, their vanguard, 98 points. It's called Signio Leonis as in the sign of Leo. And that was the one that they did, and they got it back out of the German de-alcoholization machines, which is very important because they are the best machines. And then they got it back, and they were like, okay. Well, this is the best bread in the world. And then they tweaked a couple things. They sent me a bottle. A friend of theirs, Feliz, brought it to me.

Joshua James [00:14:29]:
And then I was like, oh my goodness. Like, this isn't just better than every nonalcoholic red wine. It's, like, multiple multiple levels above anything. It's not a competition. It's unbelievable. And I I get so excited about it because pairing wine

Coach Ruby [00:14:48]:
I can't wait to try it.

Joshua James [00:14:50]:
And having those kinds of, like, emotional, memorable experiences with wine, those wine experiences that we had. Now there's something that you can have and that's just super exciting.

Coach Susan [00:15:07]:
That is so exciting.

Coach Ruby [00:15:08]:
Yeah. I can't wait to try it. You get to try it at the winery, Susan. So cool.

Coach Susan [00:15:12]:
Or their tasting room might

Coach Ruby [00:15:13]:
have been I mean yeah. That's so cool. Yeah. So you keep alluding to how big this NA industry and this movement is. Will you share a little bit more about that? What's what's happening?

Joshua James [00:15:30]:
Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, one thing I like to say to people is there's tens of millions of people that just cut back on drinking or just stopped altogether. And I like putting it like that because there's people drinking less. I've always loved that phrase, but people of course, people that drink, they're like, oh, yeah. Of course. I'd like to drink less, but now it's like over 45% of people are participating in dry January. Like, that's a huge number.

Joshua James [00:15:59]:
When you see the numbers, the actual real statistics are from Nielsen IQ, and you can see this leap every year of what it's doing the last 3 years. And that's not even, like, all of the people that are participating. It's just the stats that they get. There's like other stuff on there. It's bigger than that. But when you're talking about an industry like the alcohol industry, I mean, one of them it's it's big alcohol. I mean, give me a break. It's huge.

Joshua James [00:16:28]:
It's huge. They are freaking out right now. Mhmm. They are totally freaking out, especially in wine country because they have a bunch of wine and they have low demand. So they have oversupply and low demand in a bad way. And that's huge. But liquor companies, they're like, oh, man. We had this good for a long time, and now these millennials have turned 38, and they're not drinking as much.

Joshua James [00:16:54]:
And for some reason

Coach Ruby [00:16:55]:
Yeah.

Joshua James [00:16:55]:
The 24 year old ain't feeling the booze, and this is just getting started. So watching big guys get

Coach Ruby [00:17:04]:
to the top pivot. Yeah. Can I share something that I actually shared at Sober in the City, when I was in person? And I just would love to hear what you have to say about it. It totally dovetails with what you're talking about. So I still get, like, emails, for wine industry events. I'm in wine country, and I used to work in the wine industry for 20 years. So, I got these emails, and they were having a conference. And this is from so this is an email from them, from the wine industry conference.

Coach Ruby [00:17:38]:
She said that or they said that they're having a session, which will focus on one of the most pressing topics within the wine industry today, the anti alcohol movement. And this session will review a recent consumer research study detailing the challenges of attracting new wine drinkers and the misinformation propagated by anti alcohol lobbyists. I believe that any reasonable person who has been following the news cannot help but see that the wine industry is in danger. When the World Health Organization says that no amount of alcohol, not one single drop of wine is safe, it's time to pay attention. Additionally, our panel will provide viewers with a better understanding of the challenge facing wine from the neo prohibitionists, introduce new consumer campaigns, and offer tools and inspiration to push back against the rising trend. So what do you think of that, Josh? I I know.

Joshua James [00:18:40]:
Wow. I know of this webinar because I am less than one degree of separation from a person that was on the panel, so I knew about it well beforehand. And I've had a lot of time to think about this. I was not able to make that webinar, that path, I was not able to view it, but my PR person is. So one of my employees was there. And, let me be clear first of all. And this to me is extremely important right now, and I hope as many people can hear this as possible. First of all, I don't see anybody who is anti alcohol.

Joshua James [00:19:18]:
Now what I and an anti alcohol lobbyist would be is an extremely few people. It's that the whole headline was different than the content of the actual meeting, which is fortunately because that kind of rhetoric is creating an us and them. And in all of the owners that I deal with,

Coach Ruby [00:19:39]:
and

Joshua James [00:19:39]:
all of the vendors, and all of the producers, and all of the people like you, and everybody else is just like, this is so cool. Like, wellness. Everybody's on board for wellness. So if there's propaganda that's gonna be created from the $1,000,000,000,000 industry of alcohol that sounds like that, that's not cool because that's like it's creating sides and it's Right. If there is some kind of war, when I can tell you beyond a shadow of a doubt that there is not a war. This is about having more choices, and there's

Coach Ruby [00:20:09]:
people that

Joshua James [00:20:10]:
are stoked that they exist right now. And everybody's on board for wellness. The neo prohibitionist language and the anti alcohol language is not necessary.

Coach Ruby [00:20:20]:
I don't like it.

Joshua James [00:20:21]:
I really hope that that is not something that continues because it's not necessary. And it's

Coach Ruby [00:20:27]:
Me too. Kinda

Joshua James [00:20:28]:
it's so I just wanna make a click. Everybody's stuck. Everybody's happy, except for alcohol losing a bunch of big dollars. Totally understandable. But you know what? That's what I'm here for. I will have a conversation with the biggest CEO and the biggest boss of any corporation and company. Like, please, I would love to sit down with you guys because I can give you perspective on what just happened and what's happening right now, but also how to pivot. And, like, it's you're gonna have to pivot.

Joshua James [00:20:55]:
This is a title, so it's just getting started.

Coach Ruby [00:20:59]:
Exactly. And I wanna say to every winery, make an NA wine. Make an alcohol free wine out there and just have more choices. I mean, that's what I wish could happen so that every winery could still have people that are not drinking or drinking at their winery. And, yeah. So, I really value your opinion.

Joshua James [00:21:22]:
Making moves to make sure Napa has an ability to actually pivot. They're already starting the research on it. I know a few people deep in Napa, and there are things happening right now. I would love to be a part of that, at least to consult and advise because I got tons of valuable information on that.

Coach Ruby [00:21:43]:
Awesome. Wow. So cool. Wow. Yeah. I was wondering, would you like to segue into, like, talking about some of these? You know, you do all these reviews. And, what are some of your non, favorite, you know, nonalcoholic beverages? Or tell us a little bit about your cafe and, like, the mixology classes. I have lots of groups that I'm in, and they're like, oh, I tell them that I was there last month doing a mixology class, and it was so much fun.

Coach Ruby [00:22:14]:
So people are loving it, by the way. So

Joshua James [00:22:16]:
Yeah. That's, like, my favorite thing to do. It is so fun to for an hour straight, just taste people on as many things as you can and stuff that's hard to find. I got all the not just a bunch of stuff, but I just have, like, my favorite stuff. You know? And I'm just like, check this out, and I'll make a cocktail and check this out. It's in wine. I'm just like, check this out. It's really, really awesome.

Joshua James [00:22:37]:
In the mixology class, I like to do even more. Like, it's just fun for me to teach people how to make a world class cocktail on their first try. Like, that's super fun. But I, as as as far as your first

Coach Ruby [00:22:48]:
question,

Joshua James [00:22:49]:
I would love to talk about, in 2021 and 2022, there was a very different selection of products. And a lot of people and a lot of brands had come out with things that were trying to copy the alcohol world. And, honestly, failing, it just wasn't great. Like, I can make something taste good. That's what I do. But, like, I, we're in 2023 and 2024 now. There's a lot more things that are so much cooler, and I wish every bartender knew because they still got the taste of nonalcoholic whiskey in their mouth. And I'll tell you right now across the board, like, I'm over it.

Joshua James [00:23:25]:
I'm over nonalcoholic whiskey because it's setting the expectation here, and it's just, like, not reaching it at all. And it is a harder sell to bring something new because people are like, nuh-huh. And but, like, this stuff is so much cooler, and it's what bartenders can get behind. And they have no idea that it exists. But they know nonalcoholic whiskey exists, and they know it sucks. And they know nonalcoholic mezcal exists, and it's, like, kinda tastes like watered down something smoky. I don't know. So that's where it started.

Joshua James [00:23:59]:
And what it's going into is something I'm really excited about, which is, like, essentially herbalism. It's coming full circle after 150 years or a 1000 years or whatever. And these are the herbs that have evolved, to help de-stress the body. Like, that's what adaptogens are. Things that de stress the body. They also may not be for everybody except for especially for people that, like, take SSRIs. There might be some conflict, maybe some other medication. But there's, like, 100 adaptogens.

Joshua James [00:24:33]:
So, like, you can't really say, oh, well, they all can, you know, have issues. It's just you'd have to do your research, consult your doctor. They may not be for everybody, but I love that there's beverages with rhodiola and ashwagandha and lion's mane. And I could name off 10 other ones, and I get to make drinks with them. And it's so inspiring for me. That's the stuff that I'm really into right now.

Coach Ruby [00:25:01]:
So cool. I just discovered Ashwagandha or how you say it. Ashwagandha. Sorry. And I take it, like, right before a bet. It's just so relaxing. I don't it just it's a different I don't know if it's different brain waves or something, but I it's it's very relaxing. So that would be super cool.

Coach Susan [00:25:21]:
Yeah. Yeah. I love the new drinks that are coming out that don't try to mimic an alcoholic beverage. And, I mean, I remember trying one and it was just like this experience of, I have no idea what this is gonna taste like. And how many times do we have that experience in our life where, you know, we just don't know what everything tastes like in the world. Right? Pretty much. You know? And so to have this experience to go, oh, I'm really not sure what this is gonna taste like. And I find them to be just very some of them complex and adult and have a little bit of a bite and a little bit of a linger, and that's what I love.

Coach Susan [00:25:59]:
So I'm enjoying kind of, you know, trying out some of these new products and, and seeing which ones I like that taste good because guess what? Alcohol really doesn't taste good.

Coach Ruby [00:26:08]:
Yeah. It's not the alcohol that tastes good. Yeah.

Coach Susan [00:26:11]:
Yeah. So, that's been fun for me.

Coach Ruby [00:26:14]:
Somebody told me about this trick, for red wine that you add bitters to it, and it actually can have that more lingering feel. Yeah. There's a couple of reasons

Joshua James [00:26:27]:
for that.

Coach Ruby [00:26:27]:
What do you suggest?

Joshua James [00:26:28]:
Is a vegetable glycerin base, which actually tastes very sweet and has no sugar. Vegetable glycerin is like the sweetness of plants, if you will. And that and then it's its total viscosity. So now you have a little sweetness, and you have viscosity. And then when you get Ian's all the bitter when you get all the bitter in there, the New Orleans bitters is pretty good for that. And it can add structure and, just something really real and, and a little viscosity, a little sweetness. It's not that it's gonna make it sweet. It's just a good thing that you can add to it.

Joshua James [00:27:10]:
And it's we're just in the era where it's like, how do I make red wine taste good? Because the technology is actively getting better. It's happening in real time. We won't always have this problem. We're just having it in the early 20 twenties, but give it 2025 and 6. It's like there will be products, and then we won't be worrying about it on the 27th.

Coach Ruby [00:27:32]:
I believe you. I believe you. That sounds great.

Coach Susan [00:27:35]:
No. I love all the bitters. I have every single one

Coach Ruby [00:27:38]:
of them, I think.

Coach Susan [00:27:39]:
I put it on everything. It's great. Yeah. And lots of little diapers in my house.

Coach Ruby [00:27:45]:
Yeah. And you mentioned, like, sugar free. So, I eat a keto lifestyle, like very, very little sugar or no sugar. And so what are there, like, mocktails? Or do you call them alcohol free cocktails or mocktails? What do you prefer? And then are there sugar free ones?

Joshua James [00:28:03]:
Yeah. I'm on a team, not a mocktail. And although that word gets used all the time in my business because it's the main word for SEO and marketing, I get creative with it where I'm like Mhmm. Mocktails as the first word for a keyword are so 2021, you know, or something. No. I I I'm half kidding, but mock mocktails is still a word to define something, and that thing still exists. And that is a sugary pineapple juice based drink that honestly, I wouldn't even wanna give to my kids if I had any. And I also definitely wouldn't wanna ingest it.

Joshua James [00:28:42]:
I actually just wrote an article about this yesterday, and I I added up all the grams of sugar in a 12 ounce cup with ice Yeah. A Shirley Temple, and it was, like, 47 grams. Technically, that was 6 or 7 ounces of liquid. What? So now we have 47 grams of sugar on 6 or 7 ounces of liquid, which is over double, like, a Sprite or a Coca Cola or a ginger ginger ale. So it's like, why would you

Coach Ruby [00:29:07]:
keep it like that?

Joshua James [00:29:09]:
Like, it's not anyway, not a mocktail. So the drinks that I and then it's a $3 drink or whatever. Right? So what we can do now is we make 12 to $14 drinks, which is great for business, easy sales point, and it's also for adults because it's really millennials driving this whole market. And they grew up drinking, like, Manhattan variations and white Negronis in the cocktail renaissance of the 2010 to 2020. They don't want sweets and nobody wants sweets. I mean, some people do, but nobody really wants a sweet drink. Those are mocktails, and they're $3 or $4. So we're we're we're past that.

Joshua James [00:29:47]:
And, there's so many cool, “non-alc” cocktails. Non alc has been I've been saying that a lot, so now it's become its own word. It's like non alc. It's like that's the word.

Coach Ruby [00:29:58]:
It's a thing. Nonalc.

Coach Susan [00:30:01]:
I like that. Yeah. I like that. Cool. 

Coach Ruby [00:30:07]:
And so you have, specifically, if I go to Ocean Beach Cafe that, you know, or for people that are really watching their sugar, you can totally take care of us.

Joshua James [00:30:18]:
Yeah. Sounds good. Absolutely can. I know what I would get you. I'd get you the free Spirit Elixir stuff. It's, like, by far the most expensive thing in the room, but it's, it's the most inspiring thing too. And it is made from glycerin and has 6 or 7 different adaptogens, nootropics, and nervines. And nervines is, like, not a buzzword yet, but it's, that's that's all, herbalist language.

Joshua James [00:30:46]:
That's now buzzwords, adaptogens, and nootropics, and then nervines are things that, like, maybe soothe the nervous system, like hops or valerian root and stuff like that. But there's this really cool, Free Spirit Elixir. It's an apothecary. This couple, they make amazing stuff. Not to be confused with free spirits, nonalcoholic spirits from Mill Valley, different different folks. But, yeah, I would make you a drink with that because it's still gonna have the balance of thickness and sweetness, but no sugar.

Coach Susan [00:31:22]:
Oh, okay. I had the free spirits nightcap at one point, and it did taste very sweet to be, but it's interesting that it doesn't have a lot of sugar.

Joshua James [00:31:32]:
So sorry.

Coach Susan [00:31:32]:
My husband drank most of it, and he still drinks alcohol. So I was so mad.

Joshua James [00:31:36]:
I'm a little confused.

Coach Susan [00:31:37]:
Is this different?

Joshua James [00:31:38]:
I said free spirits. Free spirits elixirs. Sounds a lot like 3 spirits elixirs. So, yeah, there's a bunch of

Coach Susan [00:31:45]:
Oh, 3 spirits.

Joshua James [00:31:46]:
Yeah. So it's

Coach Susan [00:31:48]:
Ah, okay. Spirits. Okay.

Joshua James [00:31:50]:
So the And

Coach Ruby [00:31:50]:
they're from Mill

Coach Susan [00:31:51]:
Valley. Okay. Cool. Cool.

Joshua James [00:31:52]:
Let me just make this clear really quick. I know it's gonna be really confusing, so I'll enunciate because I do mumble a little bit. So the one that you're talking about is 3 spirits elixirs, and they're from the UK. And they make the nightcap, which is a sweet drink and has maple syrup. And it's, it's also, like, the number one seller, supposed to wind you down, and it's one of my favorite things. It's one of my favorite things to make a cocktail with too. So that's 3 spirits elixir. Then there's free spirits, which is from Mill Valley,

Coach Ruby [00:32:23]:
and then

Joshua James [00:32:23]:
they make non and then and then and then free, like, free free spirits, are Free. Non Alcoholic gin, tequila, whiskey, and Aperitivo. That is from Mill Valley. So they're alcohol analogs. That's free spirits. And then the glycerin based one that I was talking about, which is, like, $27 for 3 ounces is, and with all the adaptogens in it, that is free free spirit elixir. So they all sound similar, but they look so similar. Very different

Coach Ruby [00:32:58]:
from Okay. Yeah. They do all sound similar. Yeah. Yeah.

Coach Susan [00:33:02]:
No. The nightcap was really good, though. But my husband drank most of it, which made me really mad. I was like, that's fine. But he's becoming more alcohol free.

Coach Ruby [00:33:12]:
Yeah. Well, Susan was talking about, she might be in the area, maybe in November or something, and we might come visit the cafe, and we'll order one of these. And I might be able to come in October. I'm just so thankful for you and sharing the message. And so we're getting to the end here, and we always ask our guests, what do you feel, what do you do to feel lit alcohol free, Josh? What do you do?

Joshua James [00:33:45]:
Oh, man. I write songs. I love writing songs. That's, I don't get to do it very much because I'm crazy busy. What I get to do more often is surf. So getting barreled while surfing is, like, one of my favorite things to do. But something I get to do super often is share really, really cool beverages with people. I get a lot of enjoyment that just lights me up, and it also lights up other people.

Joshua James [00:34:14]:
So I I got 3 of them there for you.

Coach Ruby [00:34:17]:
Yeah. Oh, good. That's awesome.

Coach Susan [00:34:21]:
Yeah. I love yeah. Having a good cock, non alc cocktail. It does light you up. I mean, I went to a bridal shower and the bartender, I just went up to her and everyone was having espresso martinis. They're all young, 30, 29 year old girls. And I just said, you know, I'm alcohol free. Can you make me something? She made me the best.

Coach Susan [00:34:44]:
It was sort of a lemon drop. It was so good with a sugared rim, and it just made me feel so special and feel like I could join in. And everyone was asking me what my drink was. And it just made my experience. Right? And so you can do that. You know, you can light up someone and help someone feel special. Because we, you know, deserve a special drink. Right? Just because we don't drink alcohol.

Coach Susan [00:35:10]:
And so then when I went to the ladies' room afterwards, I had stopped by and I said, that was the best drink I've ever had. And she was like, I'm sober.

Coach Susan [00:35:20]:
And she so I appreciated it. And so that was just a really sweet little moment there. You know? Yeah. So you really can light people up, and it's so appreciated.

Coach Ruby [00:35:31]:
Yeah. And I've had, I finally found, a wine that I love, an NA wine. It's from Joyous, and they're up in Washington. And I really do. I really, really enjoyed it, and I'm looking forward now to going to Thanksgiving dinner or Christmas dinner and bringing this and putting this on the table because, well, my dad was a a winemaker, and I worked in the wine industry. So wine was always on the table. So I'm just looking forward to sharing NA wines because they're delicious, and it's gonna be a different Thanksgiving. I'm so excited. Yeah.

Joshua James [00:36:09]:
Yeah. You got it. You got it. When you come down, I'll get you a free sample of that Xiranima red. It is $69 a bottle for the large bottle, but there's a half size bottle that's $39, and it's gonna light you up. It's unbelievable. It's Alright.

Coach Ruby [00:36:24]:
Another one. We're gonna be lit Yeah. And feeling it. So, yeah, before we got on, we were talking about the name of our podcast, Feel Lit, and then it's also feel it, right, if you say it fast. So, you know, the songs and the surfing and helping people, you know, with any beverages, I just you're really, really I'm I'm really impressed with all you're doing. So thank you so much for being here. Is there anything else you wanna share? Like, where can the listeners hear more about you and connect with you? I mean, we'll put out the links below the episode, but anything else you wanna share before we end?

Joshua James [00:37:01]:
Yeah. You can, ocean.beach.cafe on Instagram. That's kind of the primary, social media account. If you really wanna, get closer, it's josh the nonalcoholic, who's still on Instagram, and I've been using that one more lately because I've been traveling so much. And one of the reasons I'm traveling is because we're actively filming. We just filmed a second location for, to create a sizzle reel, and we're gonna pitch that to Netflix, for example. So, I'm gonna get a show on Netflix or something comparable, so we can show everybody what the hell is going on and make it super fun and travel and honest and raw and hilarious. And once people have that information about what's going on in this industry, I know it's gonna help them out a lot.

Joshua James [00:37:48]:
And

Coach Ruby [00:37:49]:
I love that idea.

Joshua James [00:37:50]:
Really, really looking forward to that. And,

Coach Ruby [00:37:54]:
yeah, I'm really looking forward to that. And, yeah, I'm really looking forward to that. And, yeah, I'm really looking forward to that. And,

Coach Susan [00:37:59]:
Yeah, I'm really looking forward to that. 

Coach Ruby [00:38:01]:
I’m really looking forward to that. And, yeah, I'm really looking forward to that. And, yeah, I'm really looking forward to that. And, yeah, I'm really looking forward to that. And, experience. And you or maybe if you're in the area, you can do a mixology class and see Jay Josh and alright. Thank you, Josh. Thank you so much.

Coach Susan [00:38:17]:
Thank you so much.

Joshua James [00:38:18]:
So much for today. Yay. Bye.

Coach Ruby [00:38:23]:
Bye. Bye.

Thanks so much for listening to the Feel Lit Alcohol Free Podcast. Do you have a question you'd like us to answer on the show? All you need to do is head over to Apple Podcasts and do 2 simple things. Leave a rating and review telling us what you think of the show. And in that review, ask us any questions you have about breaking free from wine or living an alcohol free lifestyle. That's it. Then tune in to hear your question answered live. Don't forget to grab your copy of a wine free weekend at www.feellitpodcast.com
And remember, do something today that will help you feel lit. See you next time!