Sick and tired of your love hate relationship with wine? Welcome to the feel it alcohol free podcast. Hi. I'm coach Ruby Williams. And I'm coach Susan Larkin.
Ruby
00:00:11 - 00:00:16
We are 2 former wine lovers turned alcohol freedom coaches exposing the lies about alcohol
Susan
00:00:17 - 00:00:48
and giving you, our listeners, the tools to break free so you can feel lit. And when you're lit, you'll feel healthier, freer, and more in control of your life. So relax, kick back, and get ready to feel lit alcohol free. And don't forget, grab a copy of our wine free weekend guide after the show. Hey. Welcome back. We are so excited to be here. We have a special guest with us today, and we had a great, great question in our Facebook group.
Susan
00:00:48 - 00:01:46
So we brought Pam McRae on to help us answer this question. So I wanna just read the question, and then we'll introduce Pam, and we'll go from there. So this question is, how do you cope with big losses when there are times you wanna just escape for a brief while? I've been alcohol free for three and a half years, and the confidence, clarity, and peace I have gained is undeniable. But I've been navigating very painful changes and choices for those close to me, and it's natural to wanna soften the pain during those intense times like these. How do you manage without chemically altering yourself? Wow. That is such a good question. It is. That is the reason why people sometimes turn back to alcohol because it's so cult in our culture, like, oh, around funerals or, you know, you come home from the hospital of dealing with, you know, whatever, and you just wanna numb, and I get that.
Susan
00:01:46 - 00:01:53
I totally totally empathize with this listener about wanting just to numb. So it
Ruby
00:01:54 - 00:02:34
is such a great, yeah, it's such a great question. And Susan and I thought, who better to bring in than Pam McCray, the head coach for This Naked Mind? Pam is someone who grew up believing alcohol added so much to her life, only to realize how untrue that was. So she ventured in on her alcohol free life, and after suffering some several losses, she decided she wanted to help others manage grief and trauma and moving forward without alcohol. So, Pam, I am just so excited that you're here. And will you tell us a little bit about your story and how did you become a grief expert?
Pam McRae
00:02:36 - 00:03:10
Sure. I am just first off, I wanna say thank you so much for having me. Susan and Ruby, this is just such an honour to not only spend time with you but also just spread the word. But I'm just gonna sort of caveat what you said right off the bat, Ruby, with group ex with grief experts. Sorry. I gotta get my words right there. To me, there is no such thing as an expert around grief because everybody's grief is so individual. Everybody's loss, everybody's pain is so individual.
Pam McRae
00:03:11 - 00:03:29
So I like to look at myself just as someone that can help you navigate those tough times like that reader put in around wanting to escape and what it's like to truly feel the feels. So I just wanted to throw that in right off the bat.
Ruby
00:03:29 - 00:03:29
That's okay.
Pam McRae
00:03:29 - 00:03:31
A little bit about me. Yeah. Thanks.
Susan
00:03:31 - 00:03:32
That's awesome.
Pam McRae
00:03:33 - 00:04:08
Little bit about me as Ruby said, I mean, alcohol was my everything. It was the elixir to my life. It, I started when I was about 13 off and on, continued. I held the belief that it helped me with anything and everything. And when I finally realized that I was sick and tired of being sick and tired, which you will hear so many people talk about when they're going alcohol free. It was time for a change. And all of a sudden, it was like, wow. I have freedom.
Pam McRae
00:04:08 - 00:04:37
I gave up alcohol, which is something I never thought I could do, and I'm fully free. I think of alcohol as much as I think about a jar of mayonnaise in the back of my fridge. It's just it's not within my thinking. And when I became alcohol free, life still continues. Life still gets lifey. Mhmm. And in the span of just over a year, I had 3 very dramatic losses in my life. Wow.
Pam McRae
00:04:37 - 00:05:19
That truly, truly hurt right to my core. And I realized that grief is very similar to going alcohol free that nobody talks about it. Nobody wants to bring it up and just say, you know what? I hurt people. Society think, oh, okay. You know, I'm really sorry you lost your best friend or your dad or your dog or your cat or your job or your house, whatever it is, because grief can be a loss of anything. Mhmm. But it's 3 days later, and now let's get back to work or let's get back to doing things. And that's so wrong because everybody's process is different.
Pam McRae
00:05:19 - 00:05:35
Just like everybody's process about going alcohol free is different. And the more we can talk about it and the more we can bring it out into the open to say, you know what? I hurt today And make that okay. There's nothing wrong with that.
Ruby
00:05:35 - 00:05:52
Mhmm. Yeah. And what I hear is I love that I hurt today. It's temporary. Right? Like, it's it's an emotional roller coaster around losses and grief and yeah. So I love your story, Pam. Thank you.
Susan
00:05:53 - 00:06:09
Yeah. So, Pam, how would you address this question with this this reader who is alcohol free three and a half years, but now dealing with all these really hard things and wanting to just temporarily numb. And I totally get that. You know?
Pam McRae
00:06:09 - 00:06:31
Oh, I I totally get that too. It's because we don't you know, we as humans, we wanna run towards pleasure. We wanna run towards feeling good. We don't we don't run towards pain. We don't say, hey. You know what? I wanna hurt today. Let's let's try that for a day. We want to feel good.
Pam McRae
00:06:31 - 00:07:17
So when we have these deep, intense pain of hurt or sadness or grief, our automatic reaction is to run from them. And my my answer to that, it's it's kind of twofold, is the best way around it is through it. Mhmm. When we can feel something, it will pass. Mhmm. And also to always keep in mind what we resist persists. So if we want to escape something like by having a drink, all we're doing is pushing that emotion down. We're not allowing our our mind and our body to feel it because it's both mind and body.
Pam McRae
00:07:18 - 00:07:55
Mhmm. We wanna be able to process this. So what other ways can we find other than drinking to escape for a minute? For me, going to the gym. Mhmm. You know, if I've got an intense emotion that, and this is what I used with the 3 deaths that I went through. I went to the gym and gave it everything I had. I mean, I was out of breath and I was exhausted and but it processed through me. I was crying through workouts, but it allowed me to feel the emotion and then continue to move through.
Susan
00:07:56 - 00:08:20
Wow. That's amazing. I remember crying when I was on the treadmill once, and then you start to, like, hyperventilate. You have to get off and go, and people are looking at you at the gym like, what's going on with this crazy lady over here? Yeah. That's so great. That's great. How what other ways would you work with a a client, say, that came to you with with, you know, like, I'm, you know, really dealing with a lot of these hard things.
Pam McRae
00:08:21 - 00:08:47
There there's a couple of others. One that I really like is looking for the glimmers and being able to I mean, for one example, when I lost the last recent death that I went through was sudden of my best friend, who was my age, just very brief story, trimming a tree, tree trunk fell, hit him on the head. He thought he was okay, went and lied down and died.
Ruby
00:08:47 - 00:08:48
Oh my god.
Pam McRae
00:08:48 - 00:09:33
I'm so sorry. So sudden. Thank you. So sudden and so tragic and such a beautiful, beautiful person. And there were times where my heart hurts so much, and I was so angry. Mhmm. And then something would happen, and it could be something as simple as my puppy coming over to me and just sort of nudging my arm or the sun rising in the morning. And what I looked for was those little glimmers, something that made me smile just a tiny bit and being able to notice those and see those, all of a sudden, I was able to take a breath and say, okay.
Pam McRae
00:09:33 - 00:09:44
You know what? It hurts a lot right now. But seeing those glimmers means that you're gonna be okay. Yeah. And if we drink to escape, we miss them.
Ruby
00:09:45 - 00:09:45
Mhmm.
Pam McRae
00:09:45 - 00:09:49
Absolutely. They're fleeting. They happen really, really quickly.
Ruby
00:09:50 - 00:10:17
Yeah. Yeah. I love that, the glimmers. That's so beautiful. Just being grateful in the moment and aware in the moment. I that's such a beautiful I I see that oftentimes with different that word, the glimmers, and I love it. And you mentioned about, like, moving, and that just reminded me, like, I just went through a move and I wanted to numb. I wanted to escape.
Ruby
00:10:18 - 00:11:06
I didn't realize it was gonna be so challenging to go you know, when you move, you you're packing up all of your memories, and you're going through all of your stuff, and everything's coming up. So what I did was I just doubled down on my meditation and mindfulness. I did mindful guided meditations. I went back to and it's kind of the same, just to really to process and and and hugging my dog. Oh, I love that one too. I had a lot of bagel hugs. But going through it in the moment, I just I just wanna say too to this this listener that it's I really relate. I call it, like, different different things pop up that that help me numb.
Ruby
00:11:06 - 00:11:41
And and TV can be numbing for me. I don't know if it is for but I can just, like, binge watch a show. And and as long as I don't judge that, I just need that time to kinda be down, and that's okay, and it's entertaining. It's when I start judging it, I think, is when I have more of a problem with it personally, because I think we all do need downtime. We do need time to to escape in a way, whether it's exercise or walking or meditation. And I'd love to hear what you you do, Susan, too.
Susan
00:11:41 - 00:12:17
Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'm I love reading. I was a a big reader as a kid, and sometimes that's where you can find those things is if you go back and look at your childhood and think about, like, what are the ways, you know, that you coped somewhat as a child. Like, I read a lot, and I think it was a coping mechanism in some ways. I mean, I like me and my cousin, we had a competition to see who could read all of the Nancy Drew books, and I think I did. So, you know, that was like 4th through 6th grade, you know, when I was reading those kind of things, A Little House on the Prairie, etcetera. So now I've noticed that and my husband even noticed this.
Susan
00:12:17 - 00:12:59
Like, he said the other day, do you have a novel that you're reading? Because I've been a little out of sorts, and I noticed that I just need that. It's a huge escape for me just to dive into a novel. It, like, consumes all of me. I just get so into the story, and I've even combined feet up the wall and reading as such a relaxing way before I go to bed. I, like, lay there with my Kindle. And even I did it even when Ruby and I were rooming together when we went to Atlanta recently. It's just I just read a couple of chapters, and then I'm just fully relaxed. Like, it is really so I always need want to have some sort of novel going, not self help.
Susan
00:12:59 - 00:13:55
That's not what you wanna read when you're trying to to regulate your your, nervous system because, yeah, it is easier to grab a bottle of wine than it is to go, okay, I gotta get the yoga mat out and I gotta do my yoga. Like, you just you do need to make that conscious effort of like, okay, This is what I'm choosing instead and seeing I think in a moment when I had a really, really rough time and I my thoughts went to alcohol, I was like, okay, that's just a tool and I need to choose a different tool and and not even beat myself up. Sometimes I think people, we beat ourselves up for having the thought of drinking. Right? Mhmm. And it's just a tool. Okay? It's just a tool. Yeah. I thought of it because it's a tool that I've used in the past, but I'm gonna choose a different tool and just, you know, don't have that second arrow of judging yourself even for having the thought of drinking Or even if you do drink, you know what I mean, and you just get up the next day and go, okay.
Susan
00:13:55 - 00:14:11
Yeah. I made that choice. I chose that. I don't want that's not really what I want in in my life, and I'm you know, don't let it become like a 3 week drink. You know? Like, just go, oh, yeah. You know what? I made that choice. That's not a choice I really wanna make. Choose again.
Susan
00:14:11 - 00:14:15
Choose again. You know? Make a different choice. I don't know. What do you think about that, Pam?
Pam McRae
00:14:16 - 00:14:20
Oh, I I so agree. And it sort of reminds me of choose your hard.
Ruby
00:14:21 - 00:14:21
Mhmm. Yeah.
Pam McRae
00:14:22 - 00:14:28
You know? Do I want to yes. It's hard right now. You know, as Ruby described with her moving, that's hard.
Ruby
00:14:29 - 00:14:29
Yeah.
Pam McRae
00:14:29 - 00:14:42
But to choose our hard, do I wanna face this head on and get through it right now? Or do I wanna postpone everything I'm feeling and deal with it again and again and again.
Ruby
00:14:42 - 00:14:43
Yes. Yeah.
Pam McRae
00:14:43 - 00:14:52
Yeah. And I forgot to choose meditation. Yeah. Or books or, you know, whatever it is, hugging your dog, that allows you to process it right now.
Ruby
00:14:53 - 00:15:31
And I forgot to share that one of the days after I was done with a lot of the move, I spent about 2 hours just sobbing. And it was such a relief, though. I I just let myself because I was holding it all together. Right? I have to, you know, pack and clean and move and do this and do that. And all of a sudden, I just it was raining outside, and I said, I'm gonna take this these 2 hours. I just sobbed and I had and and I think that's part of it too is to feel the sadness. Feel it. Like, I really felt it because it was also the day that my son went back to Hawaii.
Ruby
00:15:31 - 00:15:32
He was visiting me.
Susan
00:15:32 - 00:15:32
So it
Ruby
00:15:32 - 00:15:44
was like this compounded thing, like, I'm so sad. But having a good cry is a really good relief. That's the pressure off. And then I it felt better. Yeah. Yeah.
Susan
00:15:45 - 00:15:54
Crying is, yeah, something that I probably would drink over in the past. I didn't like to cry. Yeah. I would cry and drink. Yeah. That's so good.
Pam McRae
00:15:54 - 00:16:28
Something else too that's really prominent with anyone that suffers any type type of grief or loss is that mix of emotions. Emotions. You know, Ruby mentions that severe sadness, but I bet you somewhere in there, there was also excitement because I'm moving and I'm, you know, I'm gonna be in a new place and recognizing that any emotion you feel is a valid emotion. Yes. Yeah. You know? Yeah. For example, when my dad passed, of it's my father. I mean, he's the first man I ever loved.
Pam McRae
00:16:29 - 00:17:10
And I was devastated and very sad, but I was also happy because he had lived a life beautifully, passed away exactly how we wanted to, and we were all together. Mhmm. So that brought a bit of happiness and a bit of, okay, dad, you're at peace. Yeah. You know? And recognizing that these emotions are okay to coexist together, and they're okay to be happy or relieved or sad or angry or frustrated or, I mean, you pull out the emotions, Will. You can have all of them going on, and that's okay. They're your emotions and they're valid.
Ruby
00:17:10 - 00:17:31
Yeah. And and there's no good or bad emotions. They're they're emotions. I when someone told me that, I was like, oh, you're so true. They're just emotions, and you just move through them. And I love what you just said, Pam, because, actually, even with the move, I was like, I was so grateful. I had the last place that I lived for 10 years. I was so grateful.
Ruby
00:17:32 - 00:17:37
You know? I just was like and it it made me think of you were so grateful to have your father, right, for all those years.
Pam McRae
00:17:37 - 00:17:38
Yeah.
Ruby
00:17:38 - 00:17:47
And then but I'm excited too to see what's in my future, what's new, what's what's this new place gonna bring me. You know? And so,
Susan
00:17:47 - 00:18:24
yeah, I kinda wanted to to pick out what you said, Pam, about relief too. Because I think sometimes when people are dealing with a a long illness or something that's going on and on, that you can feel that and just feel super guilty about it. You know what I mean? About you know? And and this what and our mindset too about our feelings. Like Ruby said that we're we're built to feel all the feelings. I think sometimes the mind, the thought that we have that may be driving us to driving us towards numbing is I can't handle this. I can't handle this right now.
Ruby
00:18:24 - 00:18:24
Mhmm.
Susan
00:18:24 - 00:18:41
My, you know, my body physically meant you know, and so what using some of the techniques, you know, that we coaches use about, is that really true? Is you know, we are built for all emotions, and we're not really taught that either. Right? You know, these are the
Ruby
00:18:41 - 00:18:42
classes we need
Susan
00:18:42 - 00:18:45
to have in high school, like emotions 101, you know, that
Pam McRae
00:18:46 - 00:18:47
you 100%.
Susan
00:18:47 - 00:19:13
Yeah. Like, oh my gosh. When have I ever used algebra or, gosh, fractions? I run I stay away from anything math. We could've we really could've used some emotional safety classes in high school. Yeah. Just learning that, okay, you can feel all the emotions. You can sob for 2 hours, like, you know, Ruby said, and you're gonna still be okay. Your body was meant to feel all emotions.
Susan
00:19:13 - 00:19:43
We just culturally say we can only handle the good ones or even labeling them good or bad. Right? Mhmm. So, yeah. I have not fortunately have not had had to deal with my parents yet, you know, death in my family, but we did when I was early on alcohol free. I was in the path at the time, the the snake of mine path, and my father-in-law was in hospice. And we I flew out. It was during COVID. It was 2020, and I flew out to LA.
Susan
00:19:43 - 00:20:19
And it was just surreal to be in a hotel during COVID. You know? And, fortunately, the bars none of the bars or restaurants were open. I think that was very helpful for me. But, you know, when you said before about being really uncomfortable around those feelings, I was definitely very uncomfortable. Like, if I was drinking, I would have been drinking a lot. And it was took everything I had in those it was day 89, I think, of the 100 days. And I was it took everything I had to to not drink during that time. And everyone else was drinking and I was over in the corner going never questioned that decision.
Susan
00:20:19 - 00:20:44
Never questioned that decision, you know, trying not to drink. Yeah. But I was very, very uncomfortable with the grief, with the all those emotions. So it's something for me to really think about, you know, as I'm in my mom's 80 and my dad's 85, you know, and they don't live forever. So I know we're in that sandwich generation of dealing with hard things with our kids and then hard things with our parents. Yeah. Yeah.
Ruby
00:20:44 - 00:21:30
Exactly. It seems like almost every client is is dealing with with 1 or both of those, you know, teenagers or or young adult children. Call them children sounds weird, but, like, you know, that and then or parents, the aging parents or so that happens a lot. So when I go back to the question that was submitted, which was such a good question, I just I want, you know, 3 and a half years alcohol free. You know, I'm 4 and a half years alcohol free. I still am navigating wanting to numb and escape, and it's just a part of life. I think this is what life gets lifey. And but it's all about what other tools and and I love this question you can ask yourself.
Ruby
00:21:30 - 00:21:55
How is numbing really gonna help? You know, that's a question you can ask yourself. And there's so many other tools, including journaling, breath work, all of these kind of tools that you could use to just slow yourself down, get present, and try to find a glimmer. Right, Pam?
Pam McRae
00:21:55 - 00:22:20
That's it. That's it. Exactly. You know? And also asking yourself, how will numbing myself help me? You know? How will it allow me to move forward? How will it allow me to move through this? It's an automatic response. Again, we wanna I the first word that comes to my mind is cower from these things.
Ruby
00:22:20 - 00:22:20
Mhmm. Mhmm.
Pam McRae
00:22:20 - 00:22:34
But we don't if we stand tall and face them, you know, even a power pose. Okay. I'm feeling really angry. I'm gonna do a power pose. Bring it on. Let's feel these emotions. I can do this.
Ruby
00:22:34 - 00:22:52
Yeah. We can do hard things. You've already done all the hard things in life already. Right? When when you have that thought, like Susan was saying, that I can't handle this, but we actually we can you can handle it. We can handle it without going to alcohol. We can. Yeah.
Susan
00:22:52 - 00:23:51
Yeah. Yeah. And then how how are you gonna be available for this emergency? Like, that's the that I love hearing that from clients when they're like, oh, my son broke his leg, and I was so grateful that I wasn't drinking that night so that I could drive him to the hospital. And then, of course, you have all your faculties and you can ask the right questions. So how I mean, yeah, it could be a super tough time with a long term illness for a loved one. But if you're numbing with alcohol at night every night, how much less faculties do you have? How much less wisdom? You don't have your spark to be able to care for them. And, you know, all the things we know about alcohols that, you know, lessens your immune system, so then are you gonna get sick because you're dealing with so much stress and then drinking over it, you know, and, you know, taking care of yourself too while you're navigating something really, really hard. You know, alcohol, as we know, is not a self self help.
Susan
00:23:51 - 00:24:32
It does not help us. You know? So, yeah, that's that's really a good thing to to think about. And, like, what is how does that make you feel? The you know, I can't handle this. I need to numb every night just would make me feel really unempowered and not at versus I can't handle this, and then just how that helps you tap into even more wisdom to be able to deal with this situation every day. Mhmm. You know, if it's a long term term or just, you know, sometimes life just throws, like, with you, Pam, 3 things in 1 year. You're just like everything comes like a tsunami at once, you know, and then you get a flat tire on top of it.
Pam McRae
00:24:32 - 00:24:32
You know?
Susan
00:24:32 - 00:24:43
It's like and you're like, excuse me. Thank you. So yeah. Oh my gosh. Hard life is hard. Life is lifey all the time. You know?
Pam McRae
00:24:44 - 00:25:02
And when you think about it, you know, especially going back to that statement, Susan, I can't handle it. If you stop just for a second and say, you know what? Right here, right now, right in this moment, I'm handling it right now. Yeah. Right now. Just for this second, I'm handling it.
Ruby
00:25:03 - 00:25:04
Yeah. Mhmm. Yeah.
Pam McRae
00:25:04 - 00:25:09
And all of a sudden that okay. You know what? I am handling it just right now.
Ruby
00:25:10 - 00:25:11
Right.
Pam McRae
00:25:11 - 00:25:17
So maybe in 5 minutes, I'll be able to handle it again and continue that on with right now. I'm okay.
Ruby
00:25:18 - 00:25:19
Mhmm. Yeah.
Pam McRae
00:25:19 - 00:25:26
I'm safe. It's hard, but I'm okay. I'm safe. I'm standing. I'm breathing. Mhmm. I'm speaking. I'm talking.
Pam McRae
00:25:27 - 00:25:28
Okay. I can handle this.
Ruby
00:25:29 - 00:25:47
Yeah. Yeah. I use that tool too where you kinda just get into your body. I put my hands here, but, like, I'm safe. I'm loved. I'm okay. And it just puts you right into your body, into the present moment, you know, and you're just you're you are okay in the moment when you when you say those words. That's beautiful, Pam.
Ruby
00:25:48 - 00:25:51
And it also made me think about, like,
Susan
00:25:52 - 00:26:19
Pam, when you just said that about also being differentiated, like, this idea of we don't have to even though we're dealing with something really hard with another person, we don't have to jump into that person's boat and be completely overcome by that situation. We are we are better if we are ourselves and whole and taking care of ourselves in order to walk alongside that person
Pam McRae
00:26:20 - 00:26:20
Yes.
Susan
00:26:20 - 00:27:06
Or pull our boat up next to that person and be a support. But we are not serving them or ourselves if we jump into their boat and become overcome by everything that they're dealing with. And when my daughter was in has and she she's out there with this. So she had an eating disorder when she was 24, and I just see so many young people having sort of this quarter century crisis. I mean, I just know so many friends whose have have had this, not necessarily eating disorder, but super big depression or anxiety, you know, right when they get out into the world with their first job. So my daughter was in treatment, month long treatment for eating disorder, and they explained it so well there. They explained it because it's hard as a parent. She's an adult.
Susan
00:27:06 - 00:27:51
She's 24, and we're her parent. And it's like, how do we some so they explained it as these dolphins. So when a dolphin's a baby, the dolphin carries the baby on her back, right, when they're children. And then the dolphin goes along then the baby dolphin or the kid dolphin, I don't know what they're called, and swims alongside them. And then the mom doll dolphin goes in front, and the baby dolphin follows, and then they're an adult and they swim off by themselves. So here, as a parent navigating with a child in this situation, we come alongside we're not gonna, like, let the baby dolphin ride on us, you know, but we come alongside and then we can lead. Like, so it was just, I don't know. I love that analogy of, like, okay.
Susan
00:27:51 - 00:28:13
No. But we are coming alongside you. You are an adult, but we are coming alongside you to support you during this really hard time. And then maybe we can lead and then maybe you'll be and then what you know, you will be able to go back out off on your own again. So I felt that that was really a helpful analogy, parents dealing with adult children going through hard things.
Pam McRae
00:28:14 - 00:28:15
I love it.
Susan
00:28:15 - 00:28:15
Yeah. I
Ruby
00:28:15 - 00:28:16
love that too. Dolphins.
Susan
00:28:17 - 00:28:38
Yeah. I know. I love dolphins too. Yes. So yay. So well, I think we are at the time of our episode where we always ask each other, and we are asking our special guests here today what you do, Pam, in your life to feel lit in your alcohol free life.
Pam McRae
00:28:38 - 00:29:14
I love this question because I think it's so important to be able to recognize what it is to feel lit and what lights you up. And for me, I I have 2 things. Being outside with my dogs, walking them every morning, that just lights up my day. That starts me on the right track. And I'm a big gym person. I love going to my classes and having that that whole energy when I'm done the class. And it's like, you know what? I feel good. I feel lit.
Susan
00:29:14 - 00:29:14
That's amazing.
Pam McRae
00:29:14 - 00:29:16
Those are those are my 2.
Susan
00:29:16 - 00:29:19
Awesome. And isn't it nice that you can do that every day?
Pam McRae
00:29:20 - 00:29:20
Yeah.
Ruby
00:29:21 - 00:29:37
I I love that. I've to me, walking my dog, also, I'm gonna relate to that, Pam. It's like Yeah. It's the most beautiful part of my day is just getting out in nature in the morning, walking my dog. Just, I love it. Yeah. I that's when
Pam McRae
00:29:37 - 00:29:39
Especially being alcohol free now.
Ruby
00:29:39 - 00:29:40
Mhmm. Yeah.
Pam McRae
00:29:40 - 00:30:11
You know, I can remember because I've had dogs forever, and I've walked them every morning forever. And there's so many mornings I had a hat on and a hood and just sort of looking down and, oh, I'm just doing this because I have to. And now I mean, even this morning, I got up and it's cold out here in Ontario, but the sky was this magnificent pink. And there was clouds and the birds were chirping, and I thought I'm present for all of that, and that lights me up.
Ruby
00:30:11 - 00:30:17
Oh, awesome. Hey, Pam. I think you're a a member of our Facebook community, I think, of the feel it.
Pam McRae
00:30:17 - 00:30:18
I am.
Ruby
00:30:18 - 00:30:43
Would you post a picture of what it looks? I'm so curious of what does it look like in Ontario this time of year when you're out walking your dogs? Or I don't know. I'm maybe asking too much, but I I would love to see that and just picture it, and and maybe Susan can do it too. And, yeah, what does it look like? I love to look at all the parts of the world and and just imagine feeling lit in Ontario.
Pam McRae
00:30:43 - 00:30:53
Sunrises are gorgeous. I I love being out walking when the sun is coming up. It's just magnet because it's different every day. Yeah. Every day, it's something different.
Susan
00:30:53 - 00:31:07
Yeah. The world is a beautiful place. I mean, it's not beautiful in Connecticut right now. The daffodils are starting to bloom. There's a few. It's we, you know, when you have the 4 seasons, we go through like the ugly season. It's kinda the ugly season right now. Ugly season.
Pam McRae
00:31:07 - 00:31:10
I hear you. I hear you with that one. But I
Susan
00:31:10 - 00:31:39
love the forsythia, which is yellow, and the daffodils. And those are the first two things that usually come up and and some of the pink cherry blossoms. Those are nice. We really appreciate the spring, the flowers when they start to come up because I grew up in California until until I moved to Connecticut. I was shocked when when everything just went away in the winter. Like, all the plants, you know, they they go dormant, and then, and I love perennials. I'm just obsessed with them because it's like they go away, and then they come back every year. And I was just like, that's it's a miracle.
Susan
00:31:40 - 00:31:52
And but Ruby lives in beautiful, beautiful wine country with all the vineyards and, yeah. I just send her pictures of the snow. She's like, I wanna see snow. I'm like, okay. So
Pam McRae
00:31:52 - 00:31:58
I'll send you pictures this weekend. We're supposed to have a big snowstorm here this weekend, so I'll send you pictures.
Susan
00:31:58 - 00:32:00
I hate that. I hate that.
Pam McRae
00:32:00 - 00:32:10
I don't want snow, but that's okay. It will melt. Yes. Just just like emotions that feel that you need to escape, it will it will all pass. Oh. The snow will melt.
Ruby
00:32:10 - 00:32:11
It's temporary.
Susan
00:32:11 - 00:32:14
I love that. Perfect. Oh, perfect. We could, like, wrap
Ruby
00:32:14 - 00:32:28
this up with a bow and say, yes, that you're going through hard times, and it's just a season of hard times. And the seasons change, and the flowers will bloom again. There. How is that how does that sound to
Susan
00:32:28 - 00:32:42
you? I love it. Perfect. I love it. Awesome. Oh, so great. Well, thanks so much for listening, and we will see you next time. And thank you for joining us, Pam. See you next time.
Susan
00:32:42 - 00:32:42Exclude
Thank you so much.
Pam McRae
00:32:42 - 00:32:47
Thank you so much for having me. It's just been my honor to be with you too.
Susan
00:32:47 - 00:32:58
Thank you. It's been our honor having you here. Thanks so much for listening to Feel It Alcohol Free Podcast. Do you have a question you'd like us to
Ruby
00:32:58 - 00:32:59
answer on the show?
Susan
00:32:59 - 00:33:16
All you need to do is head over to Apple Podcasts and do 2 simple things. Leave a rating and review telling us what you think of the show. And in that review, ask us any questions you have about breaking free from wine or living an alcohol free lifestyle. That's it. Then tune in
Ruby
00:33:16 - 00:33:23
to hear your question answered live. Don't forget to grab your copy of a wine free weekend at www.feelitpod