Susan [00:00:00]:
Sick and tired of your love hate relationship with wine?
Ruby [00:00:05]:
Welcome to the Feel It Alcohol Free podcast. Hi. I'm coach Ruby Williams.
Susan [00:00:09]:
And I'm coach Susan Larkin.
Ruby [00:00:11]:
We're 2 former wine lovers turned alcohol freedom coaches exposing the lies about alcohol
Susan [00:00:17]:
and giving you, our listeners, the tools to break free so you can feel lit. And when you're lit, you'll Feel healthier, freer,
Ruby [00:00:25]:
and more in control of your life.
Susan [00:00:27]:
So relax, kick back, and get ready to feel lit alcohol free. And don't forget.
Ruby [00:00:33]:
Grab a copy of our wine free weekend guide after the show. So let's just dive right in to our 2nd episode. And today's listener question is, what are the major challenges that you face when exploring your drinking? Susan?
Susan [00:00:50]:
Well okay. So I my biggest challenge, I think, now looking back, of course, in the moment, you don't know what your challenges are really, was Feeling like I wasn't normal and really beating myself up and trying to get back to normal. That was, like, my goal. But as I more and more learned about alcohol, I realized there is no safe there is no normal. It's an addictive substance. There's no safe level of drinking, but I didn't know that at the time. And as and I was really beating myself up and blaming myself for having a problem. And constantly in my mind, I was asking myself, how did I end up here? How did I get here? Oh my gosh.
Susan [00:01:33]:
And I was just beating myself Up About It. And when the thing that set me free really was when I went to a the Naked Mind webinar. And the one thing that Annie Grace said in that webinar That just really changed things for me was you're not broken. There's nothing wrong with you. Your brain and your body are doing what I it normally you're normal. It's
Ruby [00:01:56]:
what your brain and
Susan [00:01:57]:
body yes. It's what your brain and body would do in reaction shun to an addictive substance, and that just turned everything around. When I when I realized I wasn't defective, I didn't have a moral defect. I didn't there's nothing wrong with me. Then it was like, I could let go of that. I could let go of this getting back to normal and then really get down to the business of becoming more aware and exploring how I used alcohol as a coping mechanism and then explore better coping mechanisms. I'll just let go of that trying to get back to normal because I was really trying to hold on to both worlds. Right?
Ruby [00:02:37]:
And it
Susan [00:02:38]:
was it's really hard. It's really I needed to dive fully into I knew I was a a you know? I I needed to dive fully into exploring an alcohol free lifestyle. When I started, it wasn't forever, and I don't still say forever. That's that's a tricky word, and that can also keep people stuck, I think.
Ruby [00:03:00]:
Mhmm.
Susan [00:03:00]:
But I had to let though of this idea that there was a normal drinker out there that I needed to be. You know? So I think that was really the biggest Struggle for me that was really holding me back. And once I let go of that, it's just it wasn't easy. You know? This isn't an easy journey for Sure. Not for the faint of heart. Right? But it allowed me to start getting curious and starting to create some awareness about, oh, I used alcohol for this. Oh, I use you know, all the jobs, all the places. I used alcohol.
Susan [00:03:34]:
Yeah.
Ruby [00:03:35]:
Me too.
Susan [00:03:35]:
And then I could It just allowed me to start to work on it instead of to stay in the cycle of beating myself up. Drinking, beating myself up, taking 30 days off, Then thinking I could, you know, go have 2 drinks or 1 drink. Never. There was never 1 drink, but I would say I'm only gonna have 2, but then I would have 3, then I would beat myself up again and just in the cycle vicious cycle of failure, really, and beating myself up. So that was, I think, my biggest struggle.
Ruby [00:04:05]:
What about you, Ruby? Yeah. Well, I love what you said about, you know, Giving because wine was my drink. Right? Wine, jobs. Like, it had so many jobs, but, yeah, that just really resonated. I, you know, it I was drinking for loneliness, for boredom, to have fun, to help me sleep. I mean, I I literally goes on and on and on and on. It's it's, it's crazy when you really write it all down. But the challenge I feel like my biggest challenge was that I worked in the wine industry, which I mentioned on the last episode.
Ruby [00:04:39]:
But, like, I just wanna say that it was So normalized. Like, when you work in the industry, like, we can have tastings at 9 in the morning. We could have Lunch, drink alcohol at lunch with our boss. You know, you after in the afternoon, there might be other tastings. After work, There's, you know, maybe a birthday party. So even on the job, there were opportunities to drink every single day, multiple times per day. It's so crazy. I mean, I don't know if you guys know that out there.
Ruby [00:05:14]:
I think there's other industries or jobs where where it's like drinking's just accepted. But, so I actually I can think of one time I would I would Create rules for myself. I don't know if you did that too, Susan. Like, rules, like, okay. I'm I'm I would even buy, like, half bottles and say, I'll drink 1 bottle, but it was half bottle. But then I would just drink 2 or 3 half bottle. It wasn't a very good thinking. Right? But I just I just felt very much like if I work in the wine industry, I have to drink.
Ruby [00:05:48]:
I think the longest I ever not Didn't drink was, like, 7 days, and then there was a wine tasting. And I just told myself, well, I have to drink. I work in the wine industry. I have to do this. And it felt very lonely because everybody like, everybody's drinking is what I my experience was, like, Everybody's drinking. Everywhere, everybody's drinking, and people drink for every occasion, everything. But what happens As I start drinking more and more alone, more and more at home, and not even it was it was just an excuse, like, Went to drink more when I went out. So I think like you, Susan, I wanted to to try to be a normal drinker again.
Ruby [00:06:30]:
That was my goal. Right? Like, okay, if I get 30 days alcohol free, can I just go back to being a normal drinker? If I get 60 days, if I get a 100 days, like But once I got to, like, 60 days alcohol free, I realized I felt so much better. Like, why do I even Wanna drink? Like and then I started learning about, you know, Annie's methodology and all about Curiosity, awareness, and the science, all of that. It just was really, really fascinating to me, and I think, Yeah. I just wanna keep on track of, like, the question. Like, what were the major challenges? So, I would say working in the wine industry. And then and then thinking, like, everybody drinks. Right? It's just Everybody does it.
Ruby [00:07:23]:
Yeah. I don't know. What do you Yeah. Yeah. What do you think about that? Yeah. I think those thing
Susan [00:07:27]:
oh, I when you talked about the rules, I was thinking, oh my gosh. The rules, Like, I made you know, I tried only drinking if I'm out, but then all of a sudden, we were just going out more and spending way more money. And then we'd be spending the money, and I would think, Oh my gosh. I'm buying, you know, 3 glasses of wine here, and we could have bought a bottle and just gotten home and for $15 versus We would go and this is embarrassing. We would go to a happy hour, have, like, 2 appetizers and then drinks, and the bill would be $90 lers because it was all the drinks. Right? And we barely even ate. And so that rule was no good. You know? Any and, Oh, I've I even had taken Sharpies and put a line on the wine bottle when it was at home and didn't wanna drink below that line, but then I would.
Susan [00:08:15]:
Or here was my other sneaky thing. I never wanted to drink a whole bottle even though I definitely could at one point, So I would leave, like, an inch left in the white, and my husband was really more of a red drinker. And so I would drink, like, 3 quarters of a bottle of white, and then I would switch over to the red. So really, I really was drinking a whole bottle of wine, but it wasn't apparent by the whole bottle. So it was just these Mind tricks that that, you know, we do with ourselves and the rules. Yeah. And and then constantly beating myself up, You know, didn't help because it just keeps you you know, when you're beating yourself up and feel terrible about yourself, what do you need? You want relief from that. Your lower brain wants relief from that.
Susan [00:08:59]:
And then what's your major tool for finding relief? Alcohol. And this just keeps you in this horrible, vicious cycle. Yeah. So,
Ruby [00:09:07]:
Yeah. Rules around the amount just did not work for me because once I had 1 or 2 glasses, And if I had no alcohol in the home, like, I would even sometimes dump out alcohol and say, I'm not gonna drink tomorrow. But then you just go out and buy more. I mean, it's just it just I would try.
Susan [00:09:27]:
Yeah.
Ruby [00:09:28]:
But my biggest challenge, again, Just that everybody was drinking, all of my friends. So how how was I gonna not drink? Like, I couldn't figure out, like, how to not drink. Like, just and I felt so alone, right, in this. And is anybody else struggling? But when I read, Annie's book and in that first sentence of her book in her intro, she says something like, it's 3:33 in the morning, and I'm laying there awake beating myself up. And I finally didn't, like, feel alone. I was like, oh, other people experience this too? Just awareness, you know, awareness of Where I was giving alcohol a job was so key, I think, to starting to move through Realizing that I might have a problem. I really didn't like the term alcoholic, but that was the only term that I knew. Right? You were either a normal drinker or you were an alcoholic.
Ruby [00:10:28]:
Now I don't use that term at all anymore. I use alcohol use disorder is the term We want to start using we're trying to make it known, like, alcohol use disorder's a spectrum. You've got Someone like my grandmother who would have, like, 1 glass of champagne a year. She's on the spectrum. 2 people that are drinking all day, every day. Right? So there's There's It's not just normal drinker Right. Alcoholic. Yeah.
Susan [00:10:55]:
Yeah. No. That was very freeing to me because that The a word was very scary to me. And when I did go to AA for a while, that was just So hard for me. You know, many meetings, they go around the table, especially small women's meetings, and you say your name and you say I'm an alcoholic. I couldn't.
Ruby [00:11:14]:
I mean,
Susan [00:11:14]:
I did it, but it was like it wouldn't come out. I'd be like, I'm a I couldn't say it. It was and it didn't feel real to me, and it it was Shame. It felt shameful, and that didn't help either. But, I mean, I I sometimes tell clients, like, to get this into perspective of If you spoke to cigarette every day for, like, a week or 2 weeks, would you be surprised if you became addicted? Because we all Agree that tobacco is an addictive substance. Right. Sort of the same mindset if you drink on a regular basis And realizing that alcohol is an addictive substance, and your brain and body are doing what it normally does in Regard to or in reaction to an addictive substance, it just sort of takes it takes that morality. It takes that Out of the equation, it takes the defectiveness.
Susan [00:12:08]:
Is there something wrong with you? Out of the equation. And then and then it was like, I could get down to the business of, Okay. What's going on here with me? Okay. You know, I could accept that and go, yeah. And then I could get down to trying to do something about it. Yeah. And and that
Ruby [00:12:25]:
made all the difference for me. But talking about AA is interesting because, Right. When I brought up alcoholic and then you brought up AA, that was a big challenge. To me, before discovering, There's now, like, all this quit lip books and support group. That just even just I'm four and a half years alcohol free. Just like 5 years ago, At least I didn't find it. I couldn't find support, help. It felt I felt very alone, and there was just I had to, like, what, go to rehab or and I just wasn't I thought, well, wait a minute.
Ruby [00:13:01]:
I still have my job. I'm still, You know, what I called it, like, functioning very much functioning. So Yeah.
Susan [00:13:10]:
It
Ruby [00:13:10]:
it yeah. You're in this, but kinda stuck placed. Right? Like, what do you do? So now there's, like, books and programs and coaching. Like, Susan and I are coaches, and we love, like, helping people. Anyway, I just wanna say that too because it's just such a passion of mine now to help people that are facing these major challenges. I'd love to hear what your major challenges are if you wanna, you know, let us know in the in the notes later. But, anyway, I'm really curious.
Susan [00:13:39]:
Love to know. Yeah. I'd love to hear listeners' challenges and if you relate to some of our challenges and, Yeah. Creating awareness both around the fact that this it's normal to actually Create maybe you could word the use the word dependency around alcohol, emotional dependence on it. I didn't drink every day. I was more of a binge drinker on, like, Fridays Saturdays. I mean, sometimes I did drink during the week, but there were I usually took at least 2 to 3 year, you know, days off during the week. So, yeah, I didn't need to go to rehab.
Susan [00:14:13]:
So that what did that mean? What where am I on this In this journey, you know, what is there for me? And I agree with you that there's so much more out there, but there's still so much more awareness that can be raised about this. Yes. So I just love that word awareness because I want the public to become more aware of The fact that there is no such thing as normal and, you know, this binary thinking of it's normal and and alcoholic that that's the only option.
Ruby [00:14:41]:
Yeah. And And I just wanna say that the the the movement is real. And, like, there's the term, like, dry January. That's bringing a lot of awareness. And then people are just able to take a break in January, which is super cool.
Susan [00:14:58]:
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So Dry dry Dry January, dry July Mhmm. And sober October are, like, the 3 big ones. And it's so funny because my Anniversaries in January. My birthday is in July. So I was always like, I can't do it on those months because of my anniversary and my birthday.
Susan [00:15:15]:
Like, there's always a reason not to take a break, But taking a break is one of the best ways to be create awareness around drinking. And and just even I love the term asking what jobs have I given alcohol and creating awareness around. So like you were saying, you used it for stress. And one of the jobs I used it for was to be nicer to my husband in our marriage, And that was a big one. That was a big one. When I went back to drinking after being in AA for 8 months, one of the biggest reasons was I was mad all the time and angry, and our relationship wasn't going very well. And we and I had no I didn't learn anything in AA about New coping mechanisms or anything for my stress and anxiety, but I also just knew, like, you know, this isn't working. And one of the things that my husband and I did together was Does have wine, like, on the deck or you know what I mean? And so I was just like, this is I I just we need to get back to that because that sort of worked for us.
Susan [00:16:19]:
And that's but that's not even true because drinking to be nicer worked for 20 minutes. And then if I drink Too Much, which happened more and more often, in my drinking life. I you know, Mean Susan came out more often than not. And me and Susan came out towards the end, like, all the time. And, you know, so when my husband would sometimes in my journey go, you know, I do kinda miss us drinking, being, you know, having wine on the deck. And I'm like, did you miss it when I would get mean and nasty to you? And he's like, no. I'm like, okay. I think we better stick with this alcohol free living.
Ruby [00:16:56]:
And if you're honest with yourself and I and I was on you know, if you're really honest with yourself, alcohol changes your personality. It really does. Yeah. And I actually have friends where I can tell if they're now that I'm alcohol free, like, can tell if they've been drinking because they say mean things. I caught it's it's I just thought of that, Susan, when you said that. They're, like, either, you know, mean or they're nice. And it's like, Are they drinking or not drinking? So it's so Yeah. And kids can tell.
Ruby [00:17:25]:
I hear this so much from clients that kids can tell, that you have a different personality when you're drinking. So Yeah. Yeah. So if you're giving it a job to be, like, You know, helping yourself as a parent, like, the stress of being a parent. There's that job that I gave it myself. I, you You know, I was drinking my the whole time I raised my son. And then when he went to college, I had that empty nest kinda syndrome, and I drank even more to to relieve the the sadness of you know, he he went away to college. So I don't know if you just we're trying to really relate to all of you, and we hope that you'll just relate to us and share your experiences too.
Ruby [00:18:09]:
What are your challenges? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Susan [00:18:13]:
Bring those questions to us, and we can explore them here. So just, you know, getting curious about, is Alcohol serving you. Do you have that little small voice, you know, whispering in your ear? Maybe alcohol's a problem, and you feel like maybe you're drinking too much. Just getting curious about it and and then starting to look and create awareness around all the jobs that maybe you've given alcohol. Like, What are all the times when you drink? And, honestly, sometimes taking a short break, you know, a week, a month, you know, whatever, just to create awareness. No no myth of perfection. No, like you know, if you do decide to drink, like, just become aware of, like, oh, I drank here. I felt the urge to drink here because I felt like I would be nicer if I drank, or I felt the urge to drink here because I was stressed out from work, or I felt the urge geared to drink because whatever your reason is and just start to create the awareness and sort of a map of the jobs that you've given alcohol.
Susan [00:19:15]:
That's a great place to start.
Ruby [00:19:18]:
Really, really great. And a couple of Questions you might ask yourself is, do I really feel good, you know, after drinking alcohol? You know, our our our podcast settles feel lit. Like, do you do you feel better after drinking? I I would say no. I don't think anybody Feels like the next morning. Play it forward all the way to the next morning. Right? How do you really feel? Yeah. And are you living up to your full potential? I love that question because I just was kind of in that cycle. And then just bringing that aware which a couple of questions can bring you awareness of, You know, is alcohol serving me, or is it, you know, how is it something that's good for me? Yeah.
Ruby [00:20:00]:
So just start asking questions. Mhmm.
Susan [00:20:03]:
Yeah. That's all it needs to be. It doesn't have to be the big question of am I the a word? You know what I mean? You can decide to take a break from alcohol, or explore your drinking just because it makes you not feel good. You know? And that doesn't mean anything about you. You don't have to adopt a label. You don't have to blame yourself or get into that shame blame cycle. Please don't. You know? It's not a fun place.
Susan [00:20:28]:
You know? I was there And just I just I just want people to feel the the ability to be able to explore your drinking just like you might floor being gluten free or dairy free or, you know, anything that, you know, is totally normal in in our society of Just hey. Does this make me feel good? Does it make me feel good when I eat gluten? Does it make me feel good when I eat, you know, dairy? Does it make me feel good when I drink?
Ruby [00:20:54]:
You know? Just, I think great questions.
Susan [00:20:56]:
For it.
Ruby [00:20:57]:
Yeah. And you mentioned dry January and taking a break. I wanna share my experience real quickly because I think it might help others. I tried, like, a dry January, and I was just open to seeing what Would happen. Like, I'd never tried to take a break for that long. And with a lot of willpower and, like, I I was able to get about 14 like, a couple of weeks, and it was transformative for me how much better I felt. Like, just Knowing that after, like, a couple of weeks of not drinking, I was sleeping better, feeling better. I mean, yes, I I had kind of Detox symptoms at first, but that only lasted, like, less than a week, and then my body started healing.
Ruby [00:21:46]:
I know. I drank again. I didn't get, like, a perfect 30 days, and I didn't even care. Did you know that I actually Susan didn't care at all? I knew after 14 days, this is what I wanted. Like, I was so sure that I wanted to figure it out. Yeah. So That's good. Awareness.
Susan [00:22:03]:
That's amazing. I love that. Yeah. Yeah. That is awesome. That's so great. Well so we always end every episode mode with what am I doing today, or what are you doing today to feel lit? And I wanted to share, Ruby, because, you know, you shared last time that you do the cold showers. Yes.
Susan [00:22:20]:
And I was just like so I have been trying that. You have? And well, not fully. Here's what I'm doing. I'm doing, like, the chicken little way. I I put we have well water, and when you put it on cold, it is ice Cold, like, immediately. Well yeah. You're on
Ruby [00:22:38]:
the East Coast. Point.
Susan [00:22:40]:
Yeah. Oh, yeah. It's, like, 30 degrees today. I put it on my wrists and my feet and my face. And then the next transition, I'm gonna turn around and get it on my hair, but I have been doing that. It does feel good. It does. But I'm not ready to just stand right under the freezing cold, but I'm I'm baby steps.
Susan [00:23:00]:
Steps. I'm getting there. I'm getting there. Yeah. I'm trying it, and it does feel good. Okay. So, Susan
Ruby [00:23:06]:
oh, I was gonna ask. What are you gonna do this week? Well, one
Susan [00:23:09]:
of the things that helped me immensely Lee. In my journey exploring alcohol when I was taking a break in the early days was really creating a what I call a fierce morning routine, And that has evolved over time, and it's it's just a way to honor myself and Set myself up for success the in the morning. So I've been creating and designing and and trying things out, so just experimenting with different things. But What I've settled on recently, is I wake up and do 10 minutes of yoga, 10 minutes of just Sitting quietly and doing a little meditation, which I explored early on in my alcohol free life. I've sometimes followed. Guided meditations right now. I'm just doing 1 on my own, but to get started, I did use the guided meditations. I'm doing a 2 minute writing.
Susan [00:24:08]:
So I just write for 2 minutes. I'm doing a kind of a brain download, and I high five myself In the mirror, when I get into the to the bathroom, when I go to brush my teeth and wash my face, just to in early on, I did that, and then I'd Gotten away from it. And recently, I just decided to come back to it because I've been just feeling a little low. Maybe it's the winter or whatever. And in the beginning of my Exploring my alcohol, it was so amazing to to look myself in the eye in the morning and know that I hadn't drank the night before. And so that was Really a part of my early days and high fived myself. And, like, I looked at myself, and I said, I've got your back. Lady, I've got your back.
Susan [00:24:51]:
Like, I could start to Trust myself again, and that was meant so much. And now I just high five myself and, like, I'm I'm ready for my day. You know what I mean? Like, you got this. You know? A little pep talk I love that.
Ruby [00:25:05]:
Morning. What I love about what you said is it's, like, 10 minutes, 10 minutes, 2 minutes. And when I was, like, listening to you talk, I was kinda like, I I have the same idea, but I have, like, half hour, half hour, half hour, and it's It's kinda a little too much, so then I end up not doing it. So I
Susan [00:25:23]:
love I love your idea of 10 minutes, 10 minutes, and 2 minutes. It really does Change your day. It changes my outlook in the morning, and I've tried lots of different things. But I tried this was a fun one, Putting music on and dancing every morning even for just, like, a few not even a whole song.
Ruby [00:25:41]:
I do that.
Susan [00:25:42]:
That just cracked me up. That just cracked me up because I'm a really bad dancer. And So I would just start laughing at myself like, oh my gosh, Susan. But but that's good. You know? It was good to kinda start my day off laughing. Laughing is a great, stress reliever, and it's yeah. Just being a little more playful in life. Like, it's everything's not so serious.
Susan [00:26:03]:
You know? Like, sometimes I just say goofy things to myself in the mirror. So I would actually really love to hear From our audience, what makes you feel lit? So I'm really hoping, if you're listening, that you We'll go on to Apple Podcasts and leave a review and and ask us in your review. Tell us either ask us Question or tell us what you do to feel it, and we will feature it. Tell us your name if you want to hear your name on the podcast, your name and where you're from, and we will feature that on the podcast on upcoming episodes. Yeah. I would love I think we should just crowdsource all this. You know? Yeah.
Ruby [00:26:49]:
Alright. This has been so much fun. I can't wait to have another Let's start with you, Susan.
Susan [00:26:56]:
Yay. Yep. Look forward to meeting with you and with our listeners. Can't wait.
Ruby [00:27:02]:
Thanks so much for listening to feel it alcohol free podcast. Do you have a question you'd like us to answer on the show?
Susan [00:27:08]:
All you need to do is head over to Apple Podcasts and do 2 simple things. Leave a rating and review telling us what you think of the show. And in that review, ask us any questions you have about breaking free from wine or living an alcohol free lifestyle. That's it. Then tune in to hear your question answered live. Don't forget to grab your copy
Ruby [00:27:30]:
of a wine free weekend at wwwfeelitpodcastdot
Susan [00:27:35]:
com, and remember, do something today that will help you feel lit. See you next time.